021 CASE STUDY: How to leverage organic social media & community outreach to build a thriving brand - with Sallie Jones, Gippsland Jersey
It's Trevor, just dropping in here for a quick pre introduction, and I say that because, this interview with Sally Jones, who's a small business owner, a dynamic small business owner here in Australia. I think you'll love her story. What she's doing with social media is amazing. So if you run a business and you're interested in how social media can work for you, then you'll get a lot out of this, this episode, I'm sure. Now why I'm saying it's a pre introduction because we recorded this, the other day, but in the interim something's happened, with, Gippsland Jersey, which is Sully's company.
TREVOR YOUNG:It's a milk company, a milk brand, and it's I just wanted to add this in because it might give you a little bit of context when you listen to the full interview. But, long story short, Sally and her business partner, they run a a thriving boutique milk brand. It has just been, taken off the shelves of 1 of Australia's biggest retailers. And when I say big retailer, we've got we've got 2 really massive retailers. And so, you know, they don't make enough margin on it, so they've just deleted the line from, from their stores.
TREVOR YOUNG:Now, of course, this is a this is a massive story, a massive deal for a for a small business, of course, and Sally told her following on social media, about this, everything blew up. Social media lit up, her support was amazing and it got through to the media and she's been on radio and tv and interviews and press and everything since, so, I just wanted to drop that in because I think it's it's quite important, when you listen to the story, and and I'm giving it to you now without any context, but have that in the back of your mind that, you know, there's been an issue that Sally's brought to the fore, I. E. Her milk brand being taken off the shelves of a major retailer. She put it out on social media, so she is the media channel in that regard.
TREVOR YOUNG:It got picked up from the traditional media, plus her supporters and and her online community really rallied, to the fore as well. So we don't know where that story will end, but at least, you've got a little bit of a story. I'm starting backwards, so now we'll get into the interview. Alrighty. Welcome back to the Become Your Own PR Machine podcast.
TREVOR YOUNG:My name is Trevor Young. Got a very special guest today. I like seeing people who are out there doing stuff and, PR, digital communications, creating content on social media, joining the dots, and making it work for their brand and their business. And I like to show that when you do this stuff, things happen. And Sally Jones, from Gippsland, Jersey, a very you're a I'm calling you now, a not even a budding milk brand entrepreneur.
TREVOR YOUNG:You are a bonafide milk brand entrepreneur. Is that what you call yourself? What do you call yourself?
SALLIE JONES:Hi, Trev. Look. I have never called myself that, and I've never been called that. I've been, but I love it, and I'm gonna adopt it. I love your creativity there.
TREVOR YOUNG:Entrepreneur. There you go. You can you can take that one to the bank. Walk us through this story because, as I've just mentioned, you're doing stuff. You're out there.
TREVOR YOUNG:You're kicking goals. You're, passionate about, your brand and your business, but also about connecting with people, building ships, and and this is growing your brand. And, I don't think you use any advertising. You might do a bit, but we can unpack that. No advertising.
TREVOR YOUNG:So this is all organic, folks. We're getting out there and and, making things happen. So everything we talk about here on the podcast, Sally does. So let's start at the start. We go back a little way, Cel.
TREVOR YOUNG:So just probably set the scene for a bit of context, and then let's move into, your letter story.
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. Look. I'm a I'm a Gippsland girl. I grew up in Lakes Entrance on a dairy farm, and when I moved to Melbourne to do my university studies, I had to do an internship in public relations, and I didn't know anyone. I wasn't connected at all, and I happened to rock up to Spark Impact in Richmond and introduced myself and Trevor and, his business partner, Richard.
SALLIE JONES:I don't know. There was a very quick conversation, and the next day I found myself sitting at a desk and, they said, pack your bags. You're going on the road. You're going to deliver this great girl competition. I had no idea what any of that meant, but I I just said yes and rolled with it.
SALLIE JONES:And it was a glorious, what, 2 years, I think, I was with you.
TREVOR YOUNG:2, if not a bit more. Yeah. And, and, yes, very much a can do attitude. We had a role for you. You fit straight straight in.
TREVOR YOUNG:And, yes, on day 1, we sent you up to Brisbane, halfway across the country and, for an event that we were doing for the for Foster's, the beer brand, and Grand Prix. So that takes us back a little way, but that's your your, obviously, your background. You you then moved into sort of more account coordination, account management, and that side of things. Just quickly bridging because once you left our agency, which was called Spark Impact at the time, once you left that, our agency, what did you do then before becoming you know, bring us into the the the current day with your, your milk brand and your new business.
SALLIE JONES:Sure. So when I was working with you, Trev, I was supplementing my income by working oh, by having a stall at the Melbourne Farmer's Markets on the weekends as a side hustle because my dad at the time, as a dairy farmer, had been cut off, by the milk company, and he was throwing milk down the drain, so I felt like I had to contribute to the family a little bit, and, my pop used to drive down at 3 AM and meet me at at Collingwood Children's Farm, and I'd set up and and do market stalls. And it was within that time that the raw milk movement was starting. There was a guy that came out from America called Mark McCaffey who had a raw milk company, and they held a town meeting. There was a raw milk movement and they held a town meeting.
SALLIE JONES:I think it was the Collingwood, town hall, and he basically said raw milk's obviously illegal in Australia, but if you wanna access it, find a dairy farmer and and and tap them on the shoulder, and that's the only way you're gonna be able to get it in Australia. And he made a call, there's about 400 people as I said, and he said, is there have we got anyone in the room that has access to milk? And I I was as much as I'm an outgoing person, I I wasn't necessarily comfortable anyway. I I forced myself and I stood up, and then and he said, this. This is the woman that you need to speak to, and then I was mobbed by so many people wanting access to this milk.
SALLIE JONES:And I called dad. I remember I left. I jumped in my car, and I thought, holy moly. This is an opportunity here, and dad said, well, why don't you come home and pack your you know, we'll put this brand in your name. You don't own anything, doesn't matter if you go to jail, who cares, you you start a cosmetic bath milk company.
SALLIE JONES:So that's what we did and it was I was really grateful because I had the exposure through Spark to see how brands utilized and leveraged media stories and journalists to talk about their brands, and I'd made a contact through Richard Cornish, who is a food writer at The Age, and he was my first contact. I actually called Richard and I said I'm gonna start this milk brand. It's called cosmetic bath milk. It is not for human consumption. Would you do a story?
SALLIE JONES:And I pitched myself in, And because I've had that relationship with him coming to the farmer's markets as well, We built this built this relationship, and as I've realized in life, everything is about that relationship, authentic relationship, And, yeah, he backed me, and he did the first story, and we had rolling it out, and it was an amazing opportunity, and it really sort of, I guess, helped our family at that time to navigate that space.
TREVOR YOUNG:Yep.
SALLIE JONES:I had married a guy from the city who small, black, and blue. He was not moving to East Gippsland, and, after about a couple of years, he decided that he'd had enough and wanted to move back closer to the city, and I thought I better do the right thing, and that's when I said to dad, well, look, this is where this chapter ends for me. I have to now sort of move on and and do something else, and at that time, I felt like maybe that was the end of the whole dairy story for me. I thought that was it. I've I've, I'm done.
SALLIE JONES:Went off and did a couple of other things, went to Mount Bora as their marketing PR girl, never been to the snow for a day in my life and rocked up on my first day of the job, and it happened to be snowing. And I thought, do I walk from the car park to the office? Or how do I do this? Like, I was a perfect person because it's a beginner's mountain, so I was really able to put myself in those shoes and and, communicate, I guess, in that job as a as a first time person to the snow. So that was fun.
SALLIE JONES:I had 3 children in three and a half years. I've started the Warrigal Farmers Market because I had this amazing mother's group, and community was high vibes and, just some really capable moms, and we all kinda got together and created that.
TREVOR YOUNG:So, just for people who aren't in Australia and and even for the top end of Australia, probably don't know Gippsland. Gippsland's stretches from Melbourne to the east, and you were about 3 to 4 hours drive away originally where the farm was and then, moving closer in a place called Warrigal, which is not too far away from Melbourne, but still in prime dairy country, just outside of Melbourne.
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. It is. So I had so, yeah, I had the 3 kids at the market, and it was and I'd set up a little PR marketing consultancy with, another mom in my mom's group, and it was a little side hustle. We were doing some great little projects, launching new estates, rolling out food initiatives and all that kind of stuff, and life was going along quite well. It was fun.
SALLIE JONES:It was in that time that my dad had, come down with depression and psychosis, and it was very concerning, and we really went on that journey as a family to support him. And it was, yeah, very, very tragic for us that he actually did, take his own life in 2016, and that's when, for me, it was this lioness moment of going, I'm not going to accept that his life stops here. He was such a pioneer, such an entrepreneur in that dairy space, so bold, and he has an amazing story. No one even knows his story because it's not documented, but, you know, he built a brand. He he built he built multiple brands.
SALLIE JONES:So one was these ice cream brand, Riviera ice cream. So milk cows made ice cream, and then we had ice cream shops. So that was my upbringing. And to then on as well as that, he built a a milk brand called Riviera Hometown Milk, and he was literally milking the cows, processing the milk, bottling the milk, and delivering the milk, going to Woolworths, clearing the shelves, and putting himself front and center and not taking any shit from anybody, like, he was just he was yeah, and I saw that, like I wasn't super of devent, but I saw it and it was probably very influential in my life, and and and this style that I actually am am rolling with in my life now. And everybody really, I think, enjoyed, like, and and loved my dad.
SALLIE JONES:He was a story tell a natural storyteller and and quite bold. And so when he died on that day, I was so tragically heartbroken and sad about it, but inside of me in in my absolute deep gut, I knew that something good was gonna come out of this. And I had no idea, like, it was I just no idea. But then it was a couple of weeks after that my dad died that the dairy crisis happened, and my friend, Steve Ronald, who is a dairy farmer in Gyndevic, and his family his uncle had started ginger cheese up years ago when back in the day when my dad was starting up as well. He was, like, questioning why am I why am I doing this if if I'm gonna be disrespected by the industry, and I wanna actually take some control around my milk price.
TREVOR YOUNG:What's what's the dairy crisis? What just quickly, what what what what was that entail?
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. So one of the big, companies, which was Murray Goulburn, there's a number of large companies that take the farm's milk and consolidate it, and then they sell it or they process it into milk powder or whatever. So it's they dairy farm is a price takers, so you you can't set your price in Australia. You have to accept whatever the milk company tells you they're gonna pay you, and they set their price in the in the start of the year. And then what happened with Marigold when is that they changed their mind, and they said, oh, actually, what we said we're gonna pay you, we're not, and dairy farmers don't work like that.
SALLIE JONES:They forecast and budget their whole year's milk check, and they usually, have already spent it before it's come in, but that's just farming life and how it rolls, so financial pressure in in anyone's life, but especially farmers because they are playing in big big numbers and there's a lot of, you know, a lot of things at hand, is very, very tragic on mental health. And in that time, like, we experienced, and I heard and knew of people that were suiciding in that time in our rural communities because the pressure was so high. A lot of men's work, they're caught up in their identity of farming or their finances or their relationships breakdowns, and it's just system pressure cooker. And and so Steve and I had about 3 or 4 cups of coffee, not really knowing each other, but kinda did, and we came up and we see he said, well, I'd be keen to start a brand. I said, well, I would be too, and we came together with 3 pillars, and we decided over over a coffee that, 1, farmers had to be paid a fair price, the second one is around a commitment to creating social change in rural mental health, and the third one is kindness.
SALLIE JONES:And, those pillars are absolute foundation in in how we choose to conduct ourselves and do our business.
TREVOR YOUNG:And, obviously, your communications, your content, everything you do kinda falls under that. So when we hear about companies and purpose and, you know, there's a lot of cynical people out there saying, you know, they pooh pooh the whole idea, etcetera, but, you know, it's been the driving force of everything you do, and it's really your brand. You know? Those those things. You that's what you become known for.
TREVOR YOUNG:So, obviously, you've, you know, so you've got the milk. How does one start a brand then? I mean, obviously, you need to, you know, get other farmers on board. And and how long did it take you before you got your first, Gippsland, Jersey branded milk
SALLIE JONES:sold. Yeah. I know. It was it's so memorable, Trev. It's so memorable, and it's an unreal story.
SALLIE JONES:So when we decided, it was, so my dad died on in March, and we just we had milk in a bottle. We we had the conversation in June, and I remember a just life defining moment of, like, this is happening, and it was, like, falling off the side of the cliff because when you decide to do a business or whatever, there's no going back. It's your free falling. You don't know what's gonna happen. You're just rolling with it.
TREVOR YOUNG:You're building the plane as you as you fall off the cliff.
SALLIE JONES:Yep. That's right. And and so I was full of grief. I was full of emotion, and I was very charged in that time. And we had milk in a bottle with our first like, for sale in the September.
SALLIE JONES:So it was literally 3 months by the time we decided that we'd start something to having a finished good in a in a bottle with something to sell. And we launched that at the Warrigal Farmers Market, and we I I remember I'd started up the Facebook page and the Instagram page, and it got shared so much, and and I thought, wow. Like, this is this is we're gonna have support here. And then on the day that we launched it, we sold 2,000 liters of milk out of the back of their truck. People lined up, like, this doesn't people don't line up in the country.
SALLIE JONES:You better understand they just don't
TREVOR YOUNG:line up. Well, people don't line up for milk. No.
SALLIE JONES:But they just the support and the love, and I just I was so overwhelmed, and I still I still feel that overwhelmed feeling of like people would actually support us and get behind us. The way we're able to start that was just by starting up and testing the concept because we didn't know if it was gonna work.
TREVOR YOUNG:That It was called Gippsland Jersey back then?
SALLIE JONES:Yep. We launched Gippsland Jersey with those three pillars that I said. So fair to press the farmer, mental health, and the kindness.
TREVOR YOUNG:So just walk us back because this is no mean feat. Did how long before you started you went to that farmer's market and and initially started to sell your milk Mhmm. Were you on Facebook? Yeah. On social?
SALLIE JONES:I think we started the first post might have been after we decided in that June. I'd have to go back on the ground, but I remember that very
TREVOR YOUNG:couple months. Maybe a couple of months building. Do you remember how many followers you had at that time?
SALLIE JONES:About 400. All my friends. So I send it out. Obviously, we all start with our friends and our family.
TREVOR YOUNG:That's it's organic. It's you know, there's always a thing when people launch and, you know, you keep it quiet, keep it, then you get them out. But, you know, and that's probably going back to our days in PR. You'd have the big reveal, but not anymore. I mean, the reveal now is if you're gonna open a restaurant, you'd be talking about it 6 months out, 8 months out while you're building the restaurant.
TREVOR YOUNG:And and, clearly, you are telling your story and getting, obviously, talking about what what our plans were, I guess, what your plans were, you know, the the pillars, the issues in farming, and that struck an emotional chord with people.
SALLIE JONES:Yep. And it was and look, it was a perfect timing with that dairy crisis in terms of watching this brand because Australians in general were really wanting to support dairy, Australian dairy farmers, and they were like, what milk can we buy? We just wanna support Australians, and, you know, it is unfortunate that all of those brands on the supermarket shelves are foreign owned, and, you know, the money's not staying in Australia. Yes, it's Australian milk, but, they were disrespecting the dairy farmers. Yep.
SALLIE JONES:And And so was not okay.
TREVOR YOUNG:So the story there too is that I'm I'm actually quite interested to know. You had 2,000 liters of milk, and you you believed you'd be selling that, or is that just a wing and a prayer stuff? 2,000 liters. I mean, I I don't know. I can't even mention how much that is, but it feels it feels like 2,000 liters.
TREVOR YOUNG:Was that you know, did you feel there was rumblings that this was going to be good, just from Facebook?
SALLIE JONES:No. Well, we had a minimum quantity that we could get processed at the at the contract at the factory. So no. It was 5,000.
TREVOR YOUNG:Oh, fuck.
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. And we remember the milk tanker going off, like, driving down the road, and Steve and I going, like, what, like, this is so much money right now, like, we didn't even know it was just one of those moments you just gotta trust it, and you gotta roll with it.
TREVOR YOUNG:Yep.
SALLIE JONES:And even just, like, first of all, going back a step, going to the factory and and convincing this man, John Gomans, that he should actually process milk for us was a massive deal. Yeah. And because, like, we know as our little business now, 8 years in almost, how many tire kickers and people want, you know, ringing you up. So, oh, we love got this great idea. Blah blah blah.
SALLIE JONES:So he could have, like, canceled us out. We we actually did do the rounds. We pitched our story now, our idea to a number of milk companies to the big ones. They were like, no. You're too little.
SALLIE JONES:No. You're dreaming, whatever. And I remember speaking to John Gomans in this meeting that we had for him to say, please, could you process our milk? And he sat back in his chair, and he's, like, laughed with raw like, just roared with laughter when I said that we were going to market this on Facebook because he said, you know, how are you gonna how are you gonna promote this brand? Well, we're just gonna use Facebook, and he just laughed and he goes, ah, 7 day terms because you're gonna be broke.
SALLIE JONES:And and we just went, holy moly. What are we doing? But, anyway so on that day, 2,000 leaders sold out of the back of the truck, and then we managed to get a bit of momentum, and all of those people are still our absolute solid salespeople. Right? And then they they lobby their IGAs and their FoodWorks and their general store.
SALLIE JONES:Anyway, we found out that we sold out of milk, like, within 2 days, and we're sending another truck off to get processed. So
TREVOR YOUNG:Fantastic.
SALLIE JONES:Start. Yeah.
TREVOR YOUNG:So I wanna get into your approach now to PR comms, content, digital, everything. But first, just just so we can get a grasp, an idea of the size of the business. I mean, how how much, distribution how many retailers have you got now? That sort of things.
SALLIE JONES:Can you
TREVOR YOUNG:paint a picture of because you do also sell direct as well.
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. Look. We're we're lucky that we are in the majors. We are in Coles and Woolworths and
TREVOR YOUNG:The grocery retailers.
SALLIE JONES:Yep. And Ritchie's Supermarkets, IGAs, and then there's probably about 400 other stockists around
TREVOR YOUNG:2nd tier and 3rd tier. Yep.
SALLIE JONES:Yep. Like a lot of food service, like one of those high end restaurants, and now we're also pushing into New South Wales as well.
TREVOR YOUNG:Okay. So going crossing state boundaries. And, yes, you know, there's obviously specialty shops in that. Because you're a boutique brand, you're you're more expensive than, you know, the quick and dirty milk that the, the major retailers and, grocery chains sell for. So, you know, it's, you know, in times of, high interest rates, etcetera, I mean, people have to love the brand to to be, spending extra on it because it is more of a it is a premium brand.
TREVOR YOUNG:And you've also got cheeses and all sorts of, other how many other lines have you got apart from the milk? Got cream?
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. We got cream. We started with just full cream milk, and then we've gone and every you know, we've just sort been adding to that basket of dairy products, so we now have a range of light milk, unhomogenized milk with that cream on top. And that obviously comes in all sorts of shapes and sizes and bottles. Butter, cream, cultured sour cream or cream fraiche, buttermilk, ghee, and now we're sort of branching in and exploring what that cheese looks like as well, so it's a lot, yeah, it's a lot going on.
SALLIE JONES:Lots of learnings and just, I guess, trying to cater for what the market wants. We're very much about the fat. We don't we don't apologize for our fat. We don't apologize for our price. It is what it is.
SALLIE JONES:And, yeah.
TREVOR YOUNG:So let's get into the nitty gritty. You've built this brand now, and it's it's a mainstream boutique brand. Let's call it that.
SALLIE JONES:Because
TREVOR YOUNG:you are available a lot of places, and in you know, if people don't understand retail, I mean, it's distribution, particularly when the shelf life is so short. So let's not underestimate that you have to sell through. You can't just have something sitting on the shelf, like a packet of biscuits for, you know, half a half a year or whatever. So you need to move, you need to move milk quickly often. That's, I mean, that's the name of the game, being you're in a commodity business, but you've built a brand that, you know, means something to people.
TREVOR YOUNG:What's been your, just overarching approach to how we're gonna get our name out there to build brand awareness and brand affinity? Because I think, you know, awareness is one thing, but affinity is so important for you.
SALLIE JONES:Trev, that's a great question. You know, I've I've I've every single day, I am telling some kind of story on that social media page, and I did I have not spent $1 of advertising on though on any social plat platform up until a couple of years ago, and then we had a little play with some ads, but, you know, we're back to just switching them off because you might as well flush it down the toilet, really. I think if you if you're gonna do it, you just do good organic content. And, hopefully, it'll get a few shares and whatnot. I must give huge credit and thanks to the mainstream media, the Herald Sun, the Weekly Times.
SALLIE JONES:Like, there was obviously, yes, so through Spark Times, there was a guy called Ian Gilbert at the weekly times, and he gave me so many shares of, you know, free runs in that weekly time, which I'm so grateful.
TREVOR YOUNG:Which is a very, very much a, an agricultural newspaper in Australia, but it's national and it's big.
SALLIE JONES:It's big. Yeah. And, you know, I still remember that very first story of the Herald Sun coming out, and I was feeling quite nervous about it. Obviously, there's 2 stories here. There's Steve, the dairy farmer, who has, you know, lost a $180,000, you know, profit with his milk and blah blah blah, and then there's my story who, at the time, 8 years ago, we did not talk about suicide, and the journalist said, we're gonna focus on your story, and I thought, hang on.
SALLIE JONES:This is maybe like, I wasn't prepared. My family didn't even know I was starting this milk brand up. The story with me pouring this milk over with this cow was on page 3, the Herald Sun, which was, like, holy moly.
TREVOR YOUNG:Like, what? For context, the Herald Sun probably had a in those days, probably a little bit less these days, but probably about a 1000000 readers and owned by Rupert Murdoch and a big player, a big player in our world.
SALLIE JONES:So page 3, the word, you know, was saying out there, you know, dairy farmer's daughter, you know, starting new brand, and the word suicide very sort of bold, and I just remember feeling, am I comfortable?
TREVOR YOUNG:Yeah. How long was it before you got the start of getting press? Because, you know, when we talk about generating media, and and I'm a big believer that, you know, you've got to have the story for starters. So you did have a story. Just launching a milk brand by itself is not necessarily the story.
TREVOR YOUNG:But because of why you're doing it, it makes the story real. Obviously, it aligns with you know, some issues in society and what was happening economically. So it was kind of like a perfect storm from that perspective. But the fact of the matter is also you were building an under bubbling. How how long after you started the Facebook group or you started selling did that article come?
SALLIE JONES:So it it was that happened in, in the August, like, at the end of August. So we had the June, July sort of, you know, what's the brand, the labels, the whole bit. And then, yeah, in the August, I thought, right, we need to start ramping up here if we're gonna if we're gonna be able to sell this milk, and, they came out, and also had, I think, channel 9 and channel 10. We had the ABC. I felt like every news station in Australia had covered this start up milk story because as well, like, we wanted to be a good news story in the dairy industry because it was so terrible, and there was so much media and press around that dairy crisis.
SALLIE JONES:We'd also entered, a drought as well, and it was just tough. It was just tough, and the the media was looking for a good news story, and we were that. We just happened to be Yeah. The right time, right place for that, and and a big part of that was actually me telling my own very personal story about my dad, and I remember just sitting there, you know, my heart just thinking, well, like, I'm so vulnerable right now. I'm like, I did and I'm still processing it myself, and anyway, it was it was it was an amazing I've I've really healed myself, like, I've real I've really gone there.
SALLIE JONES:It saved me a lot in therapy. I can tell you that, Trev. I think a lot of journalists got a lot of tears and all that kind of stuff, but I'm so grateful to the media for, you know, yeah, just, I guess, respecting that story as well, like, as gently as they did too. So, yeah.
TREVOR YOUNG:So I I guess it all comes down to story and and, you know, a lot of people, business owners, they've got a product, and they want to get the product known and everything, but there's no story to it. You've gotta craft the story. And, of course, you know, you because you you started the brand with the story. That was The story actually started the brand that that puts you in different position. And but a lot of people, a lot of listeners, if you you know, if they they've run they've running a business where they've been doing it for a long time or they just started up or whatever, there's usually a a start up story around it, the reason why you went out and did something.
TREVOR YOUNG:And, and never underestimate the power of that why you did something. You know, it's not very you know, you get the people that I just wanna make money, and we've just created this product. There's no story there often. But, you know, when when there's a reason why people, you know, they rail against their, you know, that might be in the finance industry, and they're a start up going up against the big banks. Or it might be, you know, they're ex corporate, and we could see a better way to do this because our clients weren't being serviced well enough.
TREVOR YOUNG:And, you know, that's just a little message from from our discussion right this minute is, you know, dig deep for those stories because that's what resonates. And no doubt you've well, I know you have. You've you know, community wise, you're probably every meet up, every event, the conferences, you have been speaking in this story. You're probably sick of talk talking about it, but, you know, the the whole thing about, you know, you will get sick of the stories that you tell because if you're telling them often enough, that means that you might just be cutting through. So that's that's certainly a learning, I think, that people can take from this.
TREVOR YOUNG:Let's wheel back to social media now. On Facebook, you've got about 48,000 followers, and Instagram is pretty big for you as well with 18,000. You've got a little bit on YouTube and Twitter, but not doing too much on those 2. So it really is the meta combo, the 1 two punch of Insta and Facebook, which makes sense given your audience. Walk us through your strategy with that, your organic content strategy.
TREVOR YOUNG:How often do you post and have you sort of got types of themes or pillars, content pillars that you adhere to? I know you've got your pillars of the business and no doubt, you know, kindness and and mental health and that content over time will reflect all of those. But how do you approach social today? Do you have a content calendar? Do you wing it?
TREVOR YOUNG:Do you, because I think people would be really interested to know. And how often are you posting?
SALLIE JONES:I do have a content plan, Trev. You'd be happy to know, but
TREVOR YOUNG:I am happy. I
SALLIE JONES:am happy. I, I'm very gut feel. So if I'm feeling something, I will just generally post it. If I'm and I'm I'm very in the moment. Like, I won't sit on things either, And I think that gives it gives it more authenticity for me.
SALLIE JONES:I feel really good about posting something that's just happened or whatever. And I follow it up with a few stories to back it up as well. But, generally, ultra like, in my head, I'm like, okay. So go, mental health potential like, a mental health sort of story or something, product story, a retail store, and a farm story, and a factory story. Like, they're sort of the theme that try and work within.
TREVOR YOUNG:Yep.
SALLIE JONES:Doesn't it it it's not like that. It's quite out of whack. There's also another thing I try and run by is that we do have milkshake caravans, and we, yeah, we go out pretty much every weekend still because that old school marketing, I can't tell you that being out there, and getting them to taste the product, have an experience with the with our brand, see it. You know, there's just something about that that's worked for us, and and it's a big commitment, but I would yeah. I would I would recommend just you've gotta do the grind.
SALLIE JONES:You've gotta get out there. You've gotta walk the supermarket. Like, so often I'll just walk into a supermarket. Someone will have a bottle of my milk in the soup in their trolley, and I'll say, hey, thanks so much for buying my milk. And they're like, what?
SALLIE JONES:What? What? And I'll just start up this conversation, and and then often somehow that will end up on their social media or they they start talking about it or whatever. So that's been really cool. Just that very spontaneous, unpolished.
SALLIE JONES:It works for me because I'm not a perfectionist.
TREVOR YOUNG:Sparks word-of-mouth. Sparks word-of-mouth. Ignites word-of-mouth. Yep.
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. It's it's I can't I don't know to do I don't know how to do it any other way, but just being as it comes. So for example, just the other day, like, we're sponsoring this baking this baking show, and I said to the the the man that is running the show said, oh, look, I'll come out and I'll meet with you. I said, well, come out to the farm, and instead of sitting in an office and doing a coffee or whatever, we just lit a fire in the paddock, put the Billy T on, made some damper, and then I thought, oh, just make a bit of social media about this too. Right?
SALLIE JONES:And so What? It it for me, it's not hard work. Like, I have so much content. I've got content coming out of my ears. I can make a story out of a conversation, and
TREVOR YOUNG:Yep.
SALLIE JONES:It's it's just it's easy for me. I just wish that I probably had a bit more time to do it properly. Maybe I could do it better. Yep. But I don't.
SALLIE JONES:So
TREVOR YOUNG:Well, it takes time, but I think what I'm hearing from you, Sal, is that, you know, it is the responsibility you know, as you get bigger and everything, you you probably want what can we hand out? And I think people fall into the trap sometimes is, oh, we need to hand out someone to batch produce videos. And and I'm a big believer in that. And I actually, you know, encourage my clients to do that, particularly when time is an issue. But I guess you're out and about, and you're doing stuff.
TREVOR YOUNG:And and I think that you make it it's it shouldn't be a chore. It's it's your job. Yeah. You know, as the leader of a business, and and you are the face and the ambassador of the business, so most, business owners are the face of their business, you know, it's your job. Don't look at doing social or content or anything as I've got to do this over and above everything I also do.
TREVOR YOUNG:It is what you do. Yeah. It is what you do. It's just as important, if not more than, I don't know, taste testing and you you know, I don't know what the hells you do day to day, balancing the books. But you know what I mean?
TREVOR YOUNG:It's what I'm trying to say is that it's part of, the role, I think, of a business owner. And and I've always been a believer. I always think the content falls into 4 buckets. It's like there's either utility content, which is useful, how to educational. You probably do a little less of that.
TREVOR YOUNG:But expertise based businesses and professional services firms often do a lot more of that. You probably educate people on how milk's processed and how we make the cheese through your stories and stuff. The other one is sort of a leadership content, and you're doing that through mental health and highlighting the inequities of the industry and the plight of farmers ongoing. So I'd call that kind of taking a leadership positioning and the content reflects that. Then there's human content, which I think you probably over index on and is a reason why people are really resonating with your with your brand because, again, it's a commodity brand.
TREVOR YOUNG:And, and that's telling stories, the human stories. You tell them of the farmers. You tell them, you know, I'm meeting this person here. You know, we're doing as you said, every every conversation, meeting people, you're taking people along through the journey, and you've done that human content from day 1. And then promotional content, you do you weave in well, and people don't mind promotional content because it's supported, and they've already bought in.
TREVOR YOUNG:So they want to know where you are and, oh, you got a new product. But when people if they do social just for promotional, it'll wear off really, really quickly.
SALLIE JONES:I think people are savvy now. They know when they're when you're trying to sell them something, and I, as much as I'm meant to be, you know, sales, marketing, PR, all of the things, I'm a terrible sales person, but somehow we we we make sales, but I've I I'm I'm never like, hey, I'm never hustling hard to say buy my milk. Like, I would never say that. That is your choice. If you wanna support us, great, but that's just not my style, so I would rather just tell stories, and then if you like what you see, you like what you taste, get on board.
SALLIE JONES:But I will never I will never be a pushy salesman, and that's that's how that's the style of who we are. You're never gonna say yeah.
TREVOR YOUNG:Yeah. And and so you've got a blog, and you do highlight, the farmers. So shining the spotlight on others in the community goes to Providence. This is where we get our milk from. So that's how many farmers have you got supplying to you?
SALLIE JONES:There's 5 farms that supply milk into our factory now. So Yep. And and look. It's a job in they're a community of people as well that, they need to be respected and, you know, it's it's always a joke whenever a new farmer comes on board, just sort of almost picked up one new farmer every year in order to keep up with their supply, and they know what they're signing up for. They know that they that I will probably show up to their farm and start videoing them, and it will end up on socials and all of the other farming mates will have a have a crack and have a dig and all that kind of stuff, but they are part of our brand.
SALLIE JONES:Their photos are on the backs of the milk of the bottles with their little stories, and they're just as much as part of this as as anybody. Yeah.
TREVOR YOUNG:So good. And people buy into the backstory. They buy into the back well, they buy in the backstory. They buy into the, the provenance story. You know, when you look at it, you're just telling you're your chief storyteller.
TREVOR YOUNG:And and so you've got the blog, you've got a pretty decent email list, so you can communicate directly with people. I think you told me before. And just, you know, people are happy to give you email addresses just to keep updated with things. So that's, I think you said there was 1,000 of that, which is great. And let's just get on to the earned media side and the media coverage.
TREVOR YOUNG:How many bits of coverage do you think you have over? Just just give us a bit of paint a bit of a picture. How often do you do media and do the media come to you or do you pitch them?
SALLIE JONES:No. I I I don't actually ever pitch to them. We we held events, so the other day, we had an on farm barista day, and I did just wanna, you know, generate a little bit of media, so I I did just throw out. I just picked up the phone call, and they actually just came because I built relationships with, you know, various, and and then they tell the story, because I'm sort of thinking, well, you know, I don't wanna also be beating my own drum so much. I would rather the media tell my story than me tell it, but, I think over the years since we started, which will be almost 8 years, we would have to have had thousands of free media, like TV, print, like, the landline came and did a,
TREVOR YOUNG:a Big TV show.
SALLIE JONES:ABC landline. It's a it's a big agricultural, well respected, and Pip Courtney came and spent 3 days with me, and that was probably the, you know, we've had I've had a couple of films made about like, with my story in it, and it's been it's been a ride. I feel like I'm getting a bit old on this space, Trev, to keep showing up and smiling, but, you know, I feel I feel like, oh, surely they're just gonna get sick of Sally Jones, and, but I think as business owners and if we're in the business of building brands, we need to create we're gonna need to keep creating new stories, and I think you you taught me that, Trev. You have to keep reinventing yourself, and Yep. You know, collaborate or, you know, give the media something to talk about because often those journalists are sitting back in their desks, uninspired or, you know, the old school PR days where they used to get a lot of media releases may may or may not happen.
SALLIE JONES:I I don't know what that looks like now, but
TREVOR YOUNG:Yeah. Well, it's less less journalists doing more work, and they haven't got as much time to get out on the beta a lot a lot of the time. So if you can give them a good story, and and I think the thing is, it's about delivering the story. Here's a good idea. As you said, you if you create something so that barista day or whatever it was that you just mentioned, if you create something that's of value, then they might come.
TREVOR YOUNG:But so so what I'm hearing is that just a small percentage would be coming up with an idea, doing it, and pitching it out to them. And and it's a you as you said, it'd be a visual, thing to get them, you know, a hook into it. But everything else, people come to you. Do they just come to you for the general story? Is that that's still obviously, permeating through, you know, agriculture, lifestyle, general news, food, Epicurean.
TREVOR YOUNG:You know, like, I guess, they're all we talk about vertical markets and and and and interest, categories. You you cross those boundaries. And that's the thing. If you spoke to an agricultural, newspaper or a TV show, it's gonna be the diff it's going to be a little different and different tone because you're talking to the industry versus a foodie magazine, potentially, versus a, a news story. Are you are you pretty adept now at switching between the tone of voice that you have to have and the angle of the what what you're saying?
SALLIE JONES:Yes. Because I realized that different media need different stories, and it's about giving them what they need and what they want. And it's it's offering value, so always providing good images, strong images, or, you know, whatever they want. And I always like a little level of, you know, surprise as well. So if they show up, then I'll I'll I won't tell them about whatever's I'll give them enough, but when they get there, I'll over deliver.
SALLIE JONES:So, they always know that if they show up to do a story or for me, that I will deliver. Like, I won't let them down. There's a trust thing there, and, you know, the other day, we won Australia's Best Milk. Like, that's a big deal. Like, it was the logies of
TREVOR YOUNG:Fantastic.
SALLIE JONES:Logies of the dairy industry, and I didn't know.
TREVOR YOUNG:The Oscar award.
SALLIE JONES:It it was unbelievable. It was it was it was a week or so ago now, and I just posted a photo. I've just posted a reel on insta Facebook or whatever at or whatever at 12:30 AM when I was coming home from it. You know, a little bit like, there's spelling mistakes. Actually, you know what I did?
SALLIE JONES:I did the I did infographic on Canva, and I did the wrong freaking flag. Like, I put New Zealand flag instead of the Australian flag, and it was too late. It was going everywhere. But, you know what, Gippsland, Jersey is not perfect. It's, this is who we are, and, it was too late to pull it back because it had already it had already gone viral.
SALLIE JONES:And that next morning, like, the media started ringing, and they wanted to they wanted the story. And and as you said, like, I feel like Gippsland Jersey is its own little channel of media, and they just ring. If I post something, it and it sparks their interest and it's in line with whatever it is that's going on for them. They just give it they just ring. So, yeah.
TREVOR YOUNG:So there's a couple of things there, for people to take note of. 1, you've built relationships. That's really important. That's what's called public relations. It's all about the relationship.
TREVOR YOUNG:It's about the story. So you've got the stories down pat, and you give value all the time. So they know. So you've built that that trust. You go over and above.
TREVOR YOUNG:So obviously, if if there's a visual element to it like TV or they're going to take a photo, you make sure that they've got the elements to to go with the story, and so you're over delivering there. And they clearly are following you now on social media, and you cannot get in a better position because you have become your own media channel through through these through social and through, you know, blog and everything else that you do, that they will pick up on the story and come to you. So that's kind of like a perfect storm, I think, for you guys, is that that that's where things really can happen. But, obviously, you've, as you said, thousands, potentially of editorial exposure over over the journey. That's really, really built your brand, and you but you've had to you've had to show up.
TREVOR YOUNG:You've had to front up. You've had to continue to tell the story and put yourself out there when you there's probably times when you didn't wanna do that.
SALLIE JONES:Absolutely. I just thought this is not I I don't feel like I want to do this, but I've made sacrifices, and I've just dug deep and and done it anyway, and I think that's part of being a small start up business. You just you have to hustle hard, and you have to work, you have to show up every single day, and I don't like I don't like being the face of my like, I would rather someone else, you know, show up. I'd be happy just to be in the background, but it's just how it's rolled. It was never intentional, but, yeah, having that face and being that that story is the the foundation.
SALLIE JONES:And, I'm hoping that one of my kids, you know, will carry on the baton one day and that I can that I can step down from that. But at the moment, I I you know, this it's been so rewarding, and I'm just so grateful to, 1, our community and and all of the media that got behind to tell our story and then essentially people buying our milk. It's just been unreal.
TREVOR YOUNG:So just, finishing up, Sal, and thank you for telling your story because it's it's a brilliant one. What are some tips for, you know, business owners that probably are a bit reticent to put themselves out there, to get on social, to to go deeper than the normal stuff that most people post and to go deeper into their journey, deeper into behind the scenes, you know, take people behind the velvet rope of the business and and just dealing with the media and approaching the media and just getting over the hump of doing all of that?
SALLIE JONES:Look. I think it has to start with ourselves. And if you're a person that's not comfortable or, you know, a perfectionist or something like that, you really battle to be authentic. Because, like, I'm, you know, I don't really I mean, yeah, I just shared that moment of, like, putting the wrong flag up on the candle. Like, it's an absolute light.
SALLIE JONES:If I was working for businesses, I'd be getting sacked, Trev. But I think it's just not being too precious, and that works for our brand. And we've we've we've had that style and that voice of, like, authenticity all the way through it. But if, you just have to be yourself. People at the end of the day, just be yourself.
SALLIE JONES:And and I don't think you can lose. That would be my number one advice. People see through all of the stuff, I think, these days.
TREVOR YOUNG:Yeah. Yeah. There's certainly a swing. I mean, we we're we're seeing a massive swing to TikTok and raw videos because people are sort of going off the the crafted fake influencer type of thing. And really, that's what social media has always been, going back in the dark days of 2007, 'eight, 'nine, and Twitter and social media.
TREVOR YOUNG:I mean, it was more about that genuine conversations, genuine stories, and just fronting up. And you know, you know your brand and, you know, you're you're authentic to the brand. So, the brand and in most cases, the brand is you. You are the brand. So it's there's, you know, there's no disconnect there.
TREVOR YOUNG:And if you if you were just this is the way I am and the brand was super polished and everything, there would be probably a bit of a disconnect and you'd struggle. So, you know, there has to be an alignment between who you are as a person and as a founder and a business owner and and what the what the brand stands for. So I think that there's a little bit of soul searching in that, but you get that alignment, and then you know what to go out with. And, but but as I said, telling stories is really good. You know, delivering content that's useful and helpful and interesting.
TREVOR YOUNG:And, you know, again, you're a different business and a professional services firm, but I think the same kind of rules apply. There's just they're just nuanced. That's it.
SALLIE JONES:Yeah. We all love the story. We are built for human beings.
TREVOR YOUNG:Yes. Well, I want people to check you out. I don't care whether you you we've got listeners, in England and the US and in Europe. So, just jump onto Gippsland, Jersey. Now we spell it j e r s e y.
TREVOR YOUNG:I think there's different ways of spelling or maybe, maybe not. Gippsland, g I, double p, gippslandjersey.com.au. Check it out. Check out Sell on the on Facebook or Insta, and, say hello to her. And, if you're in Melbourne and you are near one of her outlets, do, buy her Gippsland jersey mill.
TREVOR YOUNG:Thanks very much, for for spending some time with us here on the podcast, Sally.
SALLIE JONES:Thank you.